Making Money Lemonade Out of Bear Market Lemons: Rebroadcast
How to take advantage of low stock prices to get more for less, and hang in there for the long run without freaking out too much now
This week, we’re rebroadcasting an episode we recorded at the end of last summer in the midst of what one hoped was a temporary bear market. The stock market keeps doing scary shit, however, so we decided it was worth a re-visit to remind ourselves, I mean our listeners, to keep our eyes on the prize and to not get spooked. Let Sara soothe you with her steely-eyed confidence that all will be well. One day.
What do you do if you actually have money to invest in the stock market but the constantly sinking numbers are scaring the shit out of you? Are you really just supposed to pour perfectly good dollars into a sinking (market) ship?
And what about that whole “buy low, sell high” thing?? Is now the low?? But can it go even lower??
And, and what the fuck are iBonds and why is everyone talking about them?!
Sara explains to Caitlin, again, what risk means when it comes to investing in the stock market, and how we get the reward for taking so much risk. Which is supposed to be the whole point. (Spoiler alert: In order to get the reward you have to stay on the (stock market) boat, even during the lows. Especially during the lows?)
And there’s more set it and forget it for the lazy, I mean wise, investors!
Ask us your dumb investing and finance questions for Season 2 on our Ask Us page!
This episode was edited by Kelly West. Music by Bad Bad Hats and Devmo.
Transcript for Season 2, Episode 3: Making Money Lemonade Out of Bear Market Lemons
Music intro by Bad Bad Hats
Caitlin Welcome to Women on the Verge of a Financial Breakthrough where we are figuring out finance, one dumb question at a time. I'm the dummy. Caitlin Meredith. I'm a mediator and coach based in the Bay Area.
Sara And I'm Sara Glakas. I'm an investor advisor and founder of Black Barn Financial, a registered investment advisor here in Austin, Texas, and also the founder of the Austin Women's Investing Group, which can be found on Meetup.
Caitlin Okay. Before we start, we wanted to thank everybody again that's written reviews. We're talking to you live freely_03 and JpinS and MamaLa S. Thank you so much for taking the time to write these iTunes reviews. They really help. Please everyone who hasn't. If you would consider doing so and share with anybody you can think of that might learn something like I am every single time we talk.
Caitlin Okay, so we're doing this little mini series before season two in the fall just to kind of get our. Well, Sara already understands all this stuff, basically, just so that I can understand the economic realities right now. So in the first little mini series episode, we talked about the context, like, what is a bear market? Is this a freaking recession or not? What does that mean? And then last episode, we talked about, you know, what not to do, how to not make it worse than it already is, and to make yourself feel a little bit safer. But I am also curious to talk about like people that have a little extra money or have incredible job security or are lucky enough to be coming into money right now or whatever. Like, what are the ways you've talked about opportunities?
Oh, my God. I have to start with what the fuck are I bonds and why is everyone talking about them and should I be paying attention? Sorry, that just came into my head. Is like urgently. You need to answer that question. What are they and is it a gimmick? Is it an e-cigarette? What is it? Why is everybody saying iBonds are awesome?
Sara Okay, so I'll start with I bonds are inflation linked to bonds. There are inflation linked treasury bonds. So they're bonds issued by the U.S. government. And the interest rate that they pay you is linked to the inflation rate that's reported. I think it's based on CPI, the consumer price index inflation rate that they report every month.
Caitlin So the bond I learn this from you is like a loan. I am you got owning the US government treasury specifically money and in return they give me an interest. They give me interest. Okay, so the bond means loan and the interest rate is like any interest rate. Usually I'm the one who gets a loan from the mortgage people and I pay them the interest rate. It's turned upside down. When you buy a bond, you're giving a loan. Okay.
Sara That's right. So that the U.S. Treasury Department will pay you an interest rate based on inflation, the inflation rate. So in normal times, this is like super boring. Over the last eight or ten, 15 years, inflation has averaged less than 2% per year. But as we all know, last year and this year, we've been experiencing very high inflation year over year. So what that means for an I bond, first of all, whenever you lend the U.S. government money, we call that a risk free loan, because the U.S. government has never not paid back the principal and interest that it owes someone. It's always paid someone back.
Caitlin So it's not like they go out, they go out of business and they're like, Sorry, your shares are worth nothing. Like they will pay me back for my loan.
Sara They will pay you back. So it's so close to certain that we call it risk free.
Caitlin Okay.
Sara So you're guaranteed to get your money back. And I think I bonds I wish I had prepared a little bit more for this question, even though you kind of told me in advance you're going to ask me about it. But as of now, the rate the annual rate on these I bonds is something like 9%. Right? Because inflation is running at 9%.
Caitlin God, this is making me think I should have bought some. Okay, keep going.
Sara Okay, so a couple of things to know about bonds, that rate, that that coupon rate or that interest rate that we just talked about, it's going to adjust every six months.
Caitlin Oh.
Sara It adjusts in May and then it's going to adjust again in November. Okay. Then you get the new inflation rate for six months and then it'll adjust again.
Caitlin Oh, it's not like you get the. When you buy it, you get that rate and it's fixed. It's a variable interest rate.
Sara So variable rate. Very important to know because if you put $10,000 in there now, you're also limited to $10,000 per calendar year.
Caitlin Okay.
Sara So if you put $10,000 in there, you'll get credited your interest every six months at whatever the rate is at that point in time. And it can change. So if inflation goes up, the rate would go up. If inflation goes down, that rate's going to go down.
Caitlin Okay. At which point I could sell it.
Sara Well, to get all of the interest that you earned, you need to keep that I bond for five years.
Caitlin Oh.
Sara And you have to keep it for at least 12 months. So it's not like a savings account. You can't just put it in and then take it back out. You have to leave it in there for 12 months. And then if you cash out the bond before the five year maturity date, you're going to sacrifice three months of interest as a penalty.
Caitlin It seems like a lot of decisions. It's the opposite of the kind of investing I want to do, which is just press the button, get the index fund and never look at it again. This one I'd have to like revisit all the time to see if I still want to have it.
Sara Yeah. You also can only buy them through the Treasury direct dot gov website, which is not the most user friendly website that anyone's ever created. They they do the best they can. Total pain to open up a new account. I mean, I shouldn't say that probably take 30 minutes to set up the account and fund it and then remember your log in and then not forget about this money that you put over there and this account during this like crazy time during 2022. But the reason people like it is it's risk free. And I mean, a 9% interest rate is really high, right? Yeah.
Caitlin Good. If it stayed that way for a long time. But then if I stayed for five years in the last three of it, it was down to 2%. It would it would of wash out, right. Like the average would then be like 3.5 or something. So it wouldn't actually be you don't know how it's going to do. It is a little bit exciting to find out. You have to wait five years, though.
Sara Right? I mean, so I would say it's a pretty good alternative for really conservative investors or for the very conservative part of your portfolio, if you would. You know, if you have a lot of money in cash, just as a matter of course and you have the opportunity to get, I don't know, maybe an average of three or three and a half percent over five years. Then you should do that. It's risk free. If you're trying to actually grow your money like we would expect in the stock market. It's not a substitute for stocks. I just don't think that's what this is going to turn into. Okay. So they are interesting to think about. Interesting to look at. I've had people who have just gone bananas and are totally in love with I bonds and I have people who are like, this doesn't really sound like it's worth my time and effort.
Caitlin The 30 minutes? My kind of people.
Sara It's usually like the 12 month lock up or, you know, the five year maturity.
Caitlin People having to put stuff on your tracker. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so what about the people that have just for whatever reason, like, don't have to change their savings plans, have a little extra money. Like where how do we take advantage? Or they how do they take advantage of this market? Like, what are the upside? Where's the silver lining?
Sara Yeah, I mean, the silver lining is that given enough time, this is going to look like a buying opportunity if the future is anything like what it has been in the past. One of the things that people often kind of throw out there is if you're thinking about investing, if you have an investment that loses 50%, you need a return of 100% to get back to even buy invest $100.
Caitlin Yeah.
Sara My $100 investment falls to $50. Right. I've lost 50%.
Caitlin Right.
Sara But now I need to make $50 on top of my $50 to get back to 100. That's a 100% return.
Caitlin Okay.
Sara And sometimes people will say this as though it's like impossible. Right. Like, yeah, that's crazy. Like, I need 100% return to get back to even. Right. But in the stock market, like, if you look back, that's how it works. Right. Stocks fall, then they need to go up by more than what they fell. Yeah. To get back to where you started.
Caitlin And then keep an eye on the trend line. Yeah.
Sara Right. That's how you make money, right? Is buying those declines and then waiting for the market to recover over some period of time. We don't know what the time period is. Right. The recovery from this decline is probably not going to be super duper fast. It's probably not going to be super duper slow. So if you have enough time to wait it out and you can accept the risk.
Caitlin That it might go lower.
Sara Today and it goes lower.
Caitlin Yeah. Don't look.
Sara I. I think if you're just going to look back at this time, especially like some of these super well-known like mega-cap tech stocks that are out there that have just, like, gotten pummeled this year. I mean, so I mean, Microsoft and Apple have hung in pretty well. Google was down by a whole bunch. It since recovered in video, down by a whole bunch and has since recovered a little bit. But you're going to have like some of these like, like world changing companies that have had a really tough year that I think that some of these companies you're going to look back and be like, I wish that I had just put some extra money.
Caitlin Which one, Sara? Which one? Just kidding. We don't have that kind of information.
Sara I am not making recommendations. It's just, you know, there's household names. I mean, Amazon fell by a whole bunch. Today, so today's what, July 29th, 2022. Amazon went up by 12% today. Right. Based on not terrible performance over the last quarter. They just reported their earnings yesterday. So there's going to be opportunities that pop out of this. It is really, really hard to figure out, like individually where the opportunities are. Yeah, but even if it's just an S&P 500 index fund or maybe an index fund that focuses on tech companies or growth companies, those are the types of companies that are having a really hard time this year in the face of higher inflation, but over long periods of time. You know, a lot of these companies are going to grow.
Caitlin They're good at figuring out how to. Yeah. Yeah. I'm assuming you mean index funds. So you're not, like, choosing a company. You're saying, like this group of companies that are in a fund so that even if one of them tanks all be okay and if not, all of them do amazing, I'll still do pretty well. That's a much better risk to take than putting all your bets on one of them.
Sara Exactly. So it's much easier to think of types of companies in 2022. Technology companies and growth companies have had a really bad, hard year. Those are probably also the types of companies that over the long run are going to be just fine. Right. So. So you can get an index fund that instead of all of the companies in the S&P 500, you can get an index fund that focuses on a subset that is growth companies.
Caitlin How do I look that up? Like literally, what do I Google.
Sara Growth stock index fund. You mean actual stocks? You just index funds.
Caitlin Yeah, I got it. I got it. And you don't have to worry about scammers. Like, will they present me with 50 and I have to go through each page? Or will there be like three?
Sara Look for the ones that are issued by the companies you know and love. So Vanguard has one, Schwab has one, Fidelity has one, iShares has one. [8.8s]
Caitlin Okay.
Sara Everyone has one of these things.
Caitlin So not like Mike's stocks dot com. Got it. Okay.
Sara You can like now people are creating all of these exchange traded funds, these ETFs that have like clever tickers and they're trying to make like clever subsets of stocks. I would maybe stay away from those. They tend to be kind of niches and narrow, but certainly like if you're looking at Vanguard or Schwab or Fidelity or iShares, you're going to end up in I mean, I think the Vanguard Growth Fund has. I don't know, 300 companies in it. Right. And you look at the holdings and you're like, oh, yeah, I've heard of all of these. So I kind of stick with the name brands if you don't want to go combing through, you know, Mike's ETF list to see which one you like the best.
Caitlin Okay, so I have three scenarios to test you with. One, someone who has never invested before and but has like a crazy savings account, let's say they've put all their money, 100, they have $100,000, are sold a house and are just holding on to that cash because they do not know what to do because the market crashed. And so they're like, this would be crazy to put it in the stock market, but what's the scenario here? We say like, yeah, I mean, I see it as an opportunity because they're buying when the market is very low. Sounds like what you're saying is as long as they're prepared to see it go even lower, if they're tracking.
Sara Yeah, I mean, for that person, I would say at this point in time, we're seven months through a bear market. It might get worse or it might get better if that person is sitting on $100,000 and knows that they want to be invested for the long run. I think a perfect strategy would be something like dollar cost averaging, where that person just deposits $5,000 per month in an S&P 500 index fund or something like that for 20 months. And then, then it's invested.
Caitlin Yeah, we did an episode on this about dollar cost averaging. It was episode 14. What do I do with a big chunk of money? And if I remember, it's like a psychological tool also that like you're not putting everything all at once. So you have like a habit, a ritual every month you're doing it, and over time you'll take some dips, but you'll also buy well, like it all even out in the end.
Sara Right. And you'll probably end up coming out ahead in a market like this one, when you're buying into a market that could continue to go down for some period of time, you'll be getting some shares that are a little bit cheaper.
Caitlin Okay, I like that. What about a person who has put in puts in $600 a month in their IRA or whatever every month, chose a very generic or target retirement fund for the year. They think they'll retire and it's just like going along that. Well, would you suggest they change up what funds they're investing in right now to take advantage of this market or like slow and steady wins the race no matter what? Stay in the big index fund.
Sara Yeah, that's a really good question. I actually had this come up the other day with a meeting that I had where like a relatively like moderately conservative investor had a little bit extra from dollar cost averaging. And now that she's at the end of her dollar cost averaging, she has a little bit left over and she decided to see this as an opportunity. So instead of the, you know, the the more conservative fund that we had talked about her investing in, she decided to take that small batch at the end and put it in something more aggressive because the market's down and she knows you're supposed to buy low and sell high. I think you can look at that and say, well, it depends on how you are viewing this market and how long you have until you need the money. Can you wait it out if it continues to get worse? I'm seeing a lot of people who are in pretty good financial shape and are worried about everyone else not being in very good financial shape. But it makes me think that a lot of people are actually in better financial shape then than we all think. And so that, you know, if you're in that camp where you are in pretty good financial shape and you can see this market decline as an opportunity. I think you could feel really good about taking advantage of that and not and not playing it too safe.
Caitlin Okay. I like that idea. It gives you some flexibility in a down market to sort of see like where you could do things a little bit differently than you would in a more stable market where you just want to be as generalized as possible. But now I'm thinking third scenario, someone who is about to retire, whose time horizon is very different for when they need that money to work for them. What we've said in the last episode, don't cash out, don't sell at all. But are there adjustments? Are there priorities that should be hap could be happening right now to lessen the impact?
Sara Yeah. So just a rule of thumb for kind of everybody, especially retirees, it's when you're going through a period of transition, you need to prepare for that before it happens. Right. So I'm just going to kind of take a step back from this example. It's like the retiree example and say if if you are getting close to this stage or if you're in this stage. It is important to have. I usually earmark five years of living expenses in something relatively safe, and that's not waiting for the market to crash to do that. That's doing that five years before you hit retirement age. Right. So it would have already been done. By the time 20, 22 came along. Okay. Does that make sense? So from from a planning perspective, if you are five years out now, start planning for where you're going to get five years of living expenses between now and 2027. If you are retired now and you didn't do any of this planning and. You went into retirement with a lot of stocks and now you're down 20%. I would start where you are today. And do some of this planning. Look around and see. Where do I get. Let's start with 12 months. Where do we get 12 months of living expenses in an emergency? It might mean carving that out of stocks that are at a decline. Not all of them, but some of them to build up that cushion in the event that the market gets worse. So it's when you're planning for a transition period and this is often retirement. It also might be if you're like if you like, done family planning, like if you know you're going to be out of work to stay home with a child or if you know that, I don't know, even if like, you know, your marriage is rocky and you might be going through a separation or divorce, carve out the money to set aside and have be pretty stable, carve that out ahead of time and don't base the decision on the markets based the decision based on your timeline for this thing, this transition you're about to.
Caitlin Go, what does that literally look like? Like changing your investments from stocks to bonds or savings account like or a mixture of the two for five, because five years of expenses can be a lot of money. So I'm assuming you don't want to in your savings account, but maybe bonds that are secure except for these stupid high bonds where you have to stay in for five years.
Sara All right. So it would be yeah. So that would probably be like a savings account, maybe a high yield savings account. You know how much I love those, but in this case, you might need one and your bond allocation in your portfolio. Okay. So so bonds this year have done poorly. Bonds are down 10% in 2022. But if you'd had. 6 to 12 months of cash and we can wait for bonds to recover, which they will given enough time. Then the cash is the first source. The bonds are the second source. And if you have five years of bonds in cash and other safe assets saved up, you can give the stocks time to recover over that period of time. Five years might. I like the five year period, at least for the first like transition stage of like leaving work, going through retirement, and then getting retirement under your belt. Because some people think that their their expenses are going to change, but you don't really know how it's going to change until you're actually doing it. So that's why I like the five years you might end up spending more money than you thought. You might end up having health related issues. You might end up wanting to travel. The five years gives you a nice big cushion, and you can always scale that back as you kind of get your bearings and figure out what your retirement life is going to look like.
Caitlin Right. You can convert some back into stocks, but as you were talking, it also thought of a scenario where, you know, you would put all this money in a 529 college savings account and your kids going to college next year. And all of a sudden you have 20% less. Like, do you use that money or do you keep it in there and take out more loans in a hope of recouping your losses in the 529 over time? Does that make sense? Like if you lost $20,000 in your 529 over the past year, do you then make up for that with loans and hold on to your 529 instead of cashing it out for your kid's college?
Sara Yeah. I am going to go back and say that I'm that I think in previous episodes we talked about this kind of five year time horizon. Yeah. You cannot have any money in stocks that you think you might need in the next five years.
Caitlin Pretty messed up people. Sorry.
Sara So if, you know, like if you didn't know that or if you kind of, you know, kind of stepped in it accidentally. Right. And made it kind of made that blunder like rolling into retirement or college, spending years being really heavily allocated towards stocks. Then just like lesson learned, right? This is exactly why you don't do that. But so if you are in that position, I would say like in that case. If my kids are freshmen and I'm using some or all of this 529 for college, I would try to maximize the amount of time that I could wait for stocks to recover. Depending on your risk tolerance, it might mean taking out student loans, maybe drawing down an emergency fund or a home equity line of credit. Kind of anything. You have to let those stocks give those stocks time, right? College typically last four or five years. That's not an insignificant amount of time. And the market might recover. Hopefully we'll recover over that time horizon. I would try to do that. I would kind of do whatever financial engineering I could to give my stocks time to recover. If that was the boat I was in right now.
Caitlin You just reminded me of something else that you had said that shocked me. Which was you. I mean, your stance is quite clear. You would do almost anything before you sold your investment portfolio. You would sell your house. I think I mean, we'll talk to your husband in a future episode about these decisions. But and you talked about getting a home equity line of credit as like things that you would do before. And so I'm curious, can you list all those things for our listener? Is all of the things you would do if you needed money or anticipating that you might need money before you would sell your investment portfolio?
Sara Let's see if I can make a list. Cut expenses. Yeah. Wherever. Take out one of those low interest credit card offers that come in the mail.
Caitlin Okay.
Sara Take out money against my home line of credit or my home equity line of credit. Maybe not sell my house and move somewhere else. I, I would definitely max out the line of credit so that I've already put in place against my house for a situation just like this. I would go to the bank and see under what terms they would loan me money, like if they're going to loan me money at five or six or 7%, and I think that stock's off of the low, maybe return seven, eight, ten or 12% per year. Then I would make that trade. I would borrow at 7% in the hopes of making 12% or more off of a lot of the low. Does that make sense? Yeah. Like you would expect to get a higher rate of return out of a downturn than you would right off the top.
Caitlin Right.
Sara What are other things that I would do?
Caitlin These are all shocking enough for me. So my belly's full. I'm just. What you are making abundantly clear is that taking on debt, even with interest rates, even with rates that might be higher than in any other terms that you would accept, will always be preferable to you than losing out on the potential yet probable returns on your investment portfolio over time.
Sara That makes me sound like like a crazy stock person.
Caitlin Gordon I would go, but yeah.
Sara I would rent out a room in my house. I would rent out that casita in my backyard. Yeah, I've got lots of ways. I've got lots of other things.
Caitlin Those kids can do, some kind of labor that brings in money.
Sara I would get a second job. I try to monetize my podcast. I would, you know, I got.
Caitlin Lots.
Sara And lots of stuff.
Caitlin I would do. Okay. I think that's the headline. Is that like anything before cashing out because what you a what you've signed up for is the risk but also be if you only get the risk without the reward, you're selling yourself literally very, very, very short. And that that growth is so important to our futures that almost everything else is at play rather than cashing out.
Sara Yeah. I mean, my feeling is we've come this far. Like, now is not the time to give up. We've come this far. If you have other options, explore them. If any of these things that I'm talking about are way outside of your risk tolerance and you won't be able to sleep at night, then it's not the right path.
Caitlin Yeah. Yeah. You know, the cold blood in your veins really helps with your tolerance for all this. Can you explain to me what a home equity line of credit is and who qualifies and what it actually means?
Sara Yes, if you own your home and you have a good amount of equity in it, then you can borrow against that equity. A bank will give you a home equity line of credit where you basically borrow against the value of your house. The rates are pretty favorable. They tend to be based on the prime rate. Maybe plus or -1%. But the idea is that if you borrow money against the home equity line of credit, then you pay interest to the bank for borrowing it. But if you have a home equity line of credit and you don't borrow against it like you have, it's like having a zero balance on your credit card. If you have a zero balance on your home equity line of credit, then you don't owe anyone anything. And it can just kind of sit there and be available to you if you need it.
Caitlin Can you spend it on anything or do you need to get a new front porch or something?
Sara Nope. You can spend it on anything.
Caitlin Like groceries.
Sara Or if you need to.
Caitlin So how does the money do you get a credit card for it or something like. Is it like a credit card?
Sara I think the way I'm with PNC Bank, I have it. It's just kind of linked in my list of accounts. So I just have to place like a request for $4,000 and I'll just put it in my checking account. I think you can also request a checkbook. So you can, you know, write a check to someone if you're renovating your bathroom, you can write a check for $10,000 to whoever is doing that.
Caitlin Okay. And you think this is a valuable, useful tool in people's sort of toolbox for how to bridge times where enough cash inflow is not great, but you have an investment portfolio to protect that. It's totally financially responsible and understandable to rely on these other credit mechanisms.
Sara To give you under. Yeah, if you understand how interest rates work, this is a variable rate. So when interest rates go up, the amount that you owe will go up. And when interest rates go down, the amount that you owe will go down. Or I'm sorry, the interest that you pay will go down and up depending on interest rates. Okay. If you understand the rates, if you're not in danger of defaulting on this home equity line of credit, this is because it's your house as collateral. If you don't pay it, they're going to come foreclose on your house. Right. So you don't want to be in a situation where your cash flow is so low that you can't make the payments, the payment. Yeah, right. Because you don't ever want to put your home at risk either. Right. But for that, I'd like to use the term bridge. Right. A bridge from here to there or an easy, quick source of liquidity or an amount of money that you can use today if you know that you'll be able to pay it back in the not too distant future. Right. Then it's just like a tool to kind of smooth out cash flows.
Caitlin How long do you have to use it once you get approved for it?
Sara I think that most of them are in place for at least ten years. And then something else happens. Like, if you have a balance after ten years, you can choose to pay interest only for a certain period of time, and then after a certain period of time, it'll start amortizing. That means you have to pay back the principal and the interest. Okay. But you can refinance. Home equity lines of credit pretty easily. And there's no closing costs. It's often way cheaper than doing a cash out refi.
Caitlin Oh. Okay. Okay.
Sara So that's another benefit to ask.
Caitlin Okay. Okay. You've given so many practical ideas here for people that both to, like, feel more secure but also maybe take advantage of these low rates, given that there's no guarantee that the market isn't going to go even lower, but it will definitely go higher also over time at some point, someone. And so if you can spend more money on it right now, you'll get that benefit in the longer term. But I think I guess what I'm pushing against is so much of this fear is also just normal people who aren't actually at risk, not wanting to have anything to do with the stock market right now because it's going low. But actually, you can flip that in your head that this is an opportunity to buy low like what you're supposed to do, given the idea that none of us will know when we've reached the bottom. The bell doesn't ring. No one calls Sara to let her know. We'll just see it in rhetoric.
Sara Let me know. Let me know when you know.
Caitlin Go on our Web site. But that it's still a good time to be investing like that's crazy, because anything else like that would be doing terribly. You wouldn't be like, Yeah, throw more money into it. But in this case.
Sara It's so counterintuitive. I know it's so counterintuitive. And again, that's why this is hard. It's why not everybody does it. It's why people have scarring experiences in the market. These are just ways to get through it. Stay on that train, keep creating wealth, and put yourself in the best position possible to make money.
Caitlin For the long run.
Sara For the long run.
Caitlin Thank you so much, Sara.
Sara Thanks, Caitlin.
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Caitlin Okay, you guys, that was the last of our three little mini episodes on how to survive and maybe even thrive in this shitty bear market. And we're going to come back in the fall, so watch out for us if you want to get a newsletter update. Join our mailing list on womenontheverge.com or you can find Sara at Sara on the Verge on Twitter or our Facebook page, which we are really almost certainly going to put something on very soon. We'll keep you updated about when the next episodes are coming. And this season, maybe, just maybe, we will answer the question, what the fuck is it Bitcoin? And do you have to be a douche bro to own one? Let's find out.
A big thank you to Kelly West, who co-produced and edited this little mini season and who tried to buy I bonds but was too frustrated by the clunky website and couldn't do it. So just goes to prove Sara, You're always right.
Music transition by Bad Bad Hats
Caitlin If your partner is making you ask for money, giving you an allowance are not letting you know about family income. This could be economic abuse.
Sara Learn more at thehotline.org, or call one 800 799 safe.
Music outro by Devmo
Devmo I know the first thing you notice is that I'm covered in gold, the flick of the wrist it could turn a hot bitch cold, to get what you want in life girl you gotta be bold. Now Imma die rich, and I know...
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